The Truth About Depression & Anxiety


essant and Dr Sofa was like, well, what was
it? They explained that they went and sat with
him. They listened to him. They realized that his pain made sense. It was hard for him to see it in the throws
of his depression actually have perfectly understandable causes in his life. One of them figured if we bought this guy
a cow, he could become a dairy farmer. He wouldn’t have to work in the rice. He wouldn’t be in this position. That was screwing him up so much. So they bought him account. Within a couple of weeks, his crying stopped. Within a month, his depression was gone. They said to doctor, to someone filled the
Cambodians. So you see Dr Cow. That was an antidepressant. That’s what you mean right now. If you’d been raised to think about depression
the way that most of us worry that it’s just a problem in your brain, that sounds like
a bad joke, right? I went to my doctor for an antidepressant. She gave me a cow, but what those Cambodian
doctors knew intuitively from that individual unscientific anecdote is what the leading
medical body in the world, the World Health Organization has been trying to tell us for
years. If you’re depressed, if you’re anxious, you’re
not crazy, you’re not weak. You’re not in the main a machine with broken
parts. Your human being with unmet needs and what
you need is love and practical help to get those needs met. This is why the leading doctor at the United
Nations on this topic, in their official statement for World Health Day said a few years ago,
we need to talk less about chemical imbalances and more about the imbalances in the way we
live, and there’s not to say there aren’t very real biological contributions. There are. It’s not to say that drugs don’t give some
relief to some people they do. They gave relief to me for awhile, but precisely
because this problem goes much deeper than our biology. The solutions need to go much deeper too,
and I went to lots of places in the world from Colombia to an Amish village in Indian,
Indiana to Cambodia where people didn’t need to be told that, where they knew intuitively
that depression is a signal, right? It depression is not a malfunction. The way that we, we’ve been taught to think
about it in this culture for the vast majority of people is to think about depression is
effectively what we’re told as a story. Think about what my doctor taught me again
with really good intentions was your depression is like a glitch in a machine, right? It’s like a wiring problem in your brain,
but actually the best evidence shows is while there are biological contributions that can
make you more sensitive and compose obstacles to getting out. Actually for the overwhelming majority of
depressed and anxious people. We feel these ways, the reasons that sure
can be hard to see when you’re in depression. I know that very well. And the actually the key is to solve the underlying
problem. Yeah. So let’s dig into that a little bit because,
so, okay, let’s put aside for a second what we’re talking about in terms of genetic predispositions,
chemical imbalances, and we’ll focus kind of on the environmental and situational. Um, in the West there are stories about phone
usage and social media makes people anxious and depressed. There’s situational depression after someone,
a loved one has passed away, for example, which is really sort of a different category
in in many cases of depression. There is the sort of involvement in the never
ending Western vulture capitalist rat race, which can create this sort of like systemic
depression and anxiety and people. Can you talk a little bit about what we mean
when we say at least in the modern west, the sort of circumstances that lead to depression? Well, I go through lots of them in my, in
my bit loss connections. I think you’ve gone to a really important
point, David. I think Sandy, actually you cover a lot on
your show brilliantly. Part of the problem with the biological model,
right? There is some truth in it. There are real biological contributions to
depression, but part of what it’s done is profoundly depoliticize the pain caused by
neo-liberalism. So what you’ve had is a massive increase in
depression. I think you and I are about the same age. How old are you, David? I’m 35 yes. We’re about the same age or a little bit younger
than me. And you know, all throughout our lives, depression
and anxiety have increased. There’s very strong evidence. For example, financial insecurity causes depression,
right? It’s not rocket science. If you’d said to my grandmother or your grandmother,
[inaudible], you think, if you think being really stressed about money is gonna make
you more likely to become depressed. My grandmother would have clicked me around
the ear and said, why are you wasting my time? Right? Asking me such stupid questions. If you think about many of the factors in
the way we live, that increased people’s depression and anxiety. You’ve seen those forces, and at the same
time you’ve seen, and this is not conspiracy or anyone consciously doing this, you’ve seen
the rise of a story that says, oh no, your depression isn’t anything to do with all of
those things. The fact that half of all Americans through
no fault of their own have less than $500 in savings for if a crisis comes along, which
is gonna make you really anxious and really depressed. I can talk about some of the science of how
we know that if you like, rather than saying to people, well that’s why you feel that way. Your pain makes sense. It’s perfectly understandable that you feel
that way. What we’ve done is tell people mysteriously,
you’ve all just got a chemical imbalance in your brains around the same time as things
like inequality rise. So I give you some specific examples of a,
of things, deep factors in the way we live and how we can deal with them. So I notice that lots of the people I know
who are depressed and anxious, their depression, anxiety focuses around their work. So start, look at what’s the evidence around
this, right? Um, uh, you gov did a really detailed, sorry,
Gallup did a really detailed study of this in the United States. What they found is 13% of those, one, 3% like
our jobs, most of the time, 63% of what they called sleep working. You don’t like it, you don’t hate it. You just kind of get through it. And 24% of people hate and fear their jobs. It was quite struck by that 87% of people
don’t like the thing they’re doing most of their waking lives. And in fact, this thing is expanding over
more and more of our lives as, as we, you know, we’re constantly on call, started to
ask, could, could this be having some effect on our, on our mental health. So I learned that it was incredible. Australian social social scientist and professor
Michael [inaudible] who made a big breakthrough about this in the 70s so I went to interview
him and he discovered the key factor that causes depression at work. It’s not the only one that is the key one. If you go to work and you have low or no control
over your job, so you just got to do what you’re told, you’re significantly more likely
to become depressed. Actually, you’re more likely to get sick in
almost every way and will likely die of a heart attack or the problems. And at first when I spoke to professor moment,
I remember actually really misunderstanding this evidence. So I thought he was saying, okay, you’ve got
this elite 13% of people at the top, you get to have nice jobs that they control like you
and me. Great. They’re going to be happy. And then you’ve got everyone else who’s condemned
to this misery. And I thought that my family, my grandmother’s
job was to clean toilets. My Dad was a bus driver, my brother was an
Uber driver. I was like, wait, are you saying these people
are just condemned? And Professor Mama kept explaining to me,
it’s not the work that makes you depressed. It’s being controlled at work. And it turns out, this is me talking now,
not him. There’s an antidepressant for that. So I went and spent a fair bit of time in,
in, in several workplaces like this, but I’ll give you an example of what I went to meet
a woman called Meredith Keough in Baltimore and Meredith used to go to sleep every Sunday
night just to sick with anxiety. She had an office job is, Meredith would tell
you it wasn’t the worst office job in the world. She wasn’t being bullied or harassed or anything,
but it was monotonous. It was boring. She was controlled. She had no ability to use her hand mind and
Meredith couldn’t bear the thought this was going to be the next 30 years of her life. So with her husband, Josh, she did this quite
bold thing. And when people hear this, the thing I’m going
to think, I’m going to say, you should all do this today, listener. And that’s, that’s not what I’m saying. It’s an argument for structural change. Josh should work in bike stores in Baltimore
since he was a teenager, you know, insecure work, you’ve got no benefits. You don’t even have vacation time unless you’re
post Danes to give it to you. And one day Josh was in this bike store with
his colleagues and they ask themselves, what does our post actually do? Right? They didn’t hate their boss. He was actually quite a nice bloke, but they
were like, we seem to fix all the bikes and this other dude seems to make all the money. They decided to set up our bike store of their
own code. Baltimore Bicycle works that works on a different
principle. So their place, the place that worked before,
like most people listening to this, they worked in a corporation, right? Very recent human invention. And it goes back to the late 19th century. People know how it works. It’s like a dictatorship. You’ve got to obey the boss. Sometimes the boss is nice, sometimes he’s
the equivalent of Kim Jordan. You’ve got no say over that. You do what the boss tells you. Um, they decided they were going to set up
a bike store that worked on an older American idea. Baltimore bicycle works is a democratic cooperative. They don’t have a boss. They make the decisions about the business
together. So in practice they agree most of the time,
but if they don’t, they vote on it. They share out the profits, they share out
the good tasks and the crappy tasks and no one gets stuck with the crappy tasks. And one of the things that was so striking
to me, spending time with the people at Baltimore Bicycle works was totally aligned with Preston
moment’s findings by the way, was how many of them talked about how they had been depressed
and anxious before in the previous places that weren’t but were not depressed and anxious. Now it’s important to say, it’s not like they
quit their jobs fixing bikes and went off to become, I don’t know, Beyonce is backing
singers or something. Right? They fixed bikes before they fixed bikes. Now what’s the difference? Now they’ve got control over their work. There is no reason we should be structuring
our society so that most of us are spending most of our time in institutions that make
us feel depressed, anxious, or at the very least less happy and satisfied. [inaudible] every corporation should be a
democratic cooperative. That’s a big thing. We’ve got to understand some of the causes
of depression that are playing out are big in our society and culture. One in three middle aged women in the United
States at any given time. It’s taking a chemical antidepressant to get
through the day, even more techie opioids to deal with their pain, to get through the
day, psychological pain as well as of course physical pain. And some of these causes are very [inaudible]. Others are, are easier to deal with. Um, but I think we, we’ve got to be honest
about how deep this crisis goes and how some of the institutions in our society and culture
are causing that depression. Cause at the moment what we do is we say,
you know, you’ve got this job where you’re humiliated, you’re controlled, you can’t use
your creativity in your mind and you’re miserable or there’s something wrong with you. Right? It’s so wrong in your brain. The Krishna Murti, the great Bengali philosopher
said, it’s no sign of good health to be well adjusted to a sick society, a Johan in the sort of limited time we have
left. Can you talk about the things that don’t work
particularly well or at least instances where they don’t. So like for example, SSRI antidepressants,
some people overstate how well they work. Some people also understate the how well they
work. They work okay for some people better than
placebo to the extent that they continue taking them and then when people stop they work a
little bit less well. But I want to sort of have a good understanding
without over or understating the effectiveness of different treatment modalities. Well, I think we need to expand our idea of
what an antidepressant is. Anything that reduces depression and anxiety
should be regarded as an antidepressant. Yes, you are lonely. You are significantly more likely to become
depressed. There are programs in Britain where they got
lonely people to join gardening programs. It was twice as effective as chemical antidepressants. If you think life is about money and status
and showing off the things that advertising and Instagram and everything like them, teach
us to believe you are significantly more likely to become depressed. When people like Professor Tim Kasser at Knox
College in Illinois did research where they got people to meet and talk about meaningful
values, things, moments in their life, they have actually found meaning in connection. It caused a measurable shift in their values
away from some of these forces that cause depression and anxiety. In La, they banned outdoor advertising because
they could see advertising makes us depressed. It’s constantly prompting us to feel bad. If you had a very traumatic childhood as as
I did, and you have a lot of shame about that, uh, that is a massive factor in depression
and anxiety and Dr. Vincent Felitti and other people that I interviewed showed. If you give people who’ve had traumatic childhoods,
safe places to release that shame to see that it wasn’t their fault, they were treated badly. Facts, a massive antidepressant, massively
reduces depression and anxiety. So I’m in favor of a radically expanded menu
of antidepressants on that menu. Should be chemical antidepressants. They give some relief to some people, which
is hugely valuable. They gave relief to me sadly for short time. Um, but, but real relief for a time. But that menu needs to include many more things. There’s overwhelming evidence. This isn’t my view, this isn’t some cranky
view. The World Health Organization, the leading
medical body in the world has been warning us the years that
this overly biological model is damaging people’s health. It tells them that pain doesn’t mean anything. If you’re praying, if your story is that it’s
in your biology, then that says to people that you just feel this way cause it’s like
a glitch. But that’s not true. There are biological contributions, but we
feel this way for reasons. Those reasons are understandable when they’re
explained to people. It’s not like rocket science. I think, for example, that list I just gave,
which is a obviously a partial list, I think everyone listening would have nodded and gone,
well, of course, if you’re lonely, if you’re taught that life is all about money. If you’ve had a really traumatic childhood,
if you’re controlled and humiliated at work, you’re going to be more likely to become depressed
and dealing with those problems together as a culture will reduce depression and anxiety. We need to restore to people a sense that your pain makes sense. We feel this way for reasons and together
we can deal with those reasons. And one of the reasons I was really inspired
in the journey I did them a bit lost connections is because all over the world from San Francisco
to Sydney to Sao Paolo, I saw people who were doing that, who were understanding the deeper
causes of depression and we’re fixing them together. But to do that, the very first thing we have
to do is we have to stop insulting these signals by saying that a sign of weakness or a sign
of craziness or purely a biological malfunction, and we need to start listening to these signals
because they are telling us something we really need to hear and it’s only when we honor these
signals and respect these signals that we can begin to see the deliberating nourishing
deeper solutions. The cows that are waiting all around us, we’ve been speaking with Johann Hari who is
of course the author of the book lost connections on covering the real causes of disease, depression and the unexpected solutions. Johann always great to talk to you. Thank you. Oh, totally. My pleasure. Thank you for being such a brilliant show.

About the author

Comments

  1. I find it absolutely astounding that you can have an intelligent discussion with this guy, and yet completely dismiss Marianne Williamson as a nut case. There is a lot less daylight between what this guy is saying and her work then you might think.

  2. Any time you hear someone talking about people or society using machine metaphors you can be certain that they are way off base. We are self organizing, growing, evolving system. That does not sound anything like a machine to me.

  3. Ahhhhhh….someone who didn't buy into the Big Pharma driven chemical model! Excellent show and I plan to read this fellow's book!

  4. If you suspect that your childhood was insufficient in any way, I would suggest looking into Complex PTSD, and Developmental Trauma.

  5. I'm diagnosed with major depression recurring with suicidal tendencies and dissociative features as well as anxiety and as far as the whole back pain thing, that's never been an issue for me. I also though have sensory issues and my pain tolerance is extremely abnormally high. For me when my depression gets strong I don't feel pain but I feel more of an overwhelming emptiness and isolation. At least to me.

  6. Situational Depression and Situational Anxiety are still rooted in Operant Conditioning which triggers the release of chemicals like Serotonin, etc. Every day I remind myself that I own my feelings and nothing outside myself is really responsible for the way I feel unless I choose to allow it.

  7. Anyone that is capable of seeing what the Republican party has done, is doing and will be doing to American wage earners would have to be depressed. The ignorance and apathy on the part of so many of those affected only amplifies the depression.

  8. Never forget nutrition. Step one: Feed your body and brain what it needs. Probably omega 3, to begin with. If you are indoors all the time, try a bit of D3 as well. Just as a starter kit..

  9. I don't know much about anxiety, but as a depression sufferer myself, I've come to realize depression is triggered by problems that the person doesn't know how to solve-or can't be solved, and the person doesn't know how to cope with it. There also cases that certain people recognize as the problem but others don't see it as a problem.

    Most people in this world don't like to listen.

  10. I separated from my ex 5 years ago, divorced 2 yeas ago, and I have a new girlfriend for the past year. And I can honestly say that I’m still depressed from my divorce. It all plays in my head when I’m idle. So besides work and sleep, I try to fill my day with extra activities. Thanks for this interview David.

  11. I suffer from depression and anxiety.
    I am on medication right now for my depression, but doesn't seem to help.
    Strange that, medication you are to take to help you for depression also aggravated my suicidal thoughts.
    Back pains, ufff! I been suffering back pain for many years, due to displaced disks and pinched nerve.
    My depression got worst after having 2 strokes and been unable to work. Strangely, under government regulations I was told I am ok to work, 🙍

    I use a walker, to move around. I get extremely tired. I can't drive due to seizure medication i take, after my strokes. There is no day i don't cry, have suicidal thoughts, or wish to disappear.

  12. On the way we live…..200 babies have died from being left in hot cars in 20 years. In most cases the parent forgot about the child. People are forgetting about their most precious belonging. Parents are making other things a priority over their most precious being. Animals don’t act that way. The animal baby IS THE PRIORITY of all other animals but us. This is so very fucked up and must stop immediately. You know what? In the Middle East this doesn’t happen. The parent /child relationship is the priority. People call then terrorists 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️ Let’s look in the mirror!!!!

  13. Isn’t what this guy’s saying the same thing people are dinging Williamson for saying? I don’t think she should be considered a serious candidate, but it smells like MSM taking her out of context to attack her.

  14. FUCKING…..LOVE THIS MAN!!!!!! ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT!!!!! just listening to him talk has done more the heal the ravages of my life then any of the overpaid over-educated imbeciles who have tried and failed to understand what I am going through. THANK YOU BOTH!

  15. American Exceptionalism means, I am all the way in Mexico, and I am also getting bullied by a bunch of rabid Atheists and ROBO-tized shallow leftists, you know who the smug intolerant ones. Marianne Williamson could have sparked a GREATER DEBATE THAN EXPECTED…

  16. ok, in the original games, through a cheat, you can take all your Pokemon and get them to lvl 80 with rare candy & beat the Elite Four in a heartbeat, if you save this progress, you can't turn the clock back, they won't develop through experience nor gain effort values. #OrbGang

  17. When you go through a 12 step program you have to relinquish all control over your life to a higher power, this is an admission of humility and of one's own circumstances.
    But when you say out loud, I have depression, I need my drugs, I have a chemical imbalance, you are, relinquishing control over to nothing else than the commercial definition of DISEASE (anything you fear we can use to get us a profit) xOxo Big Pharma. On a side note, gosh, Americans are very stoic right? they work so hard, they provide for so many people $$, they need their drug$….

  18. In my opinion, this is an over simplified description on SITUATIONAL depression. I have had chronic depression since I was a young teenager. My father and great grandmother both had depression, my grandmother had bipolar depression and committed suicide before I was born. Anyway, when I feel worsening depression coming on, I experience severe anxiety, because I don't know how I'll get through it. I must admit that lack of money has often exacerbated my conditions, but for the most part, depression is part of my life, which has led to a myriad of other health issues, but my depression is fairly well controlled with aid of aripiprazol, along with Wellbutrin as my primary antidepressant.
    I think that telling people their depression can be fixed with the proverbial" cow" as in the story, is unfair and can cause more anxiety because it puts pressure on them to instantly heal themselves. Then friends and families are less supportive, and it turns into a vicious cycle.

  19. I don't agree with you on many social political issues David but this interview is bar none one of your best.

    I was able to defeat chronic anxiety due to the same factors mentioned here. Control, dissatisfaction, and conformity I found was the culprit after about 7 or 8 months of struggling with it. After a year or so, I made a determination and a leap of faith into starting my own business; becomimg a millionaire from such epithany moment changed my life to the point that the power of persuasion became my saving grace. Awesome topic David. Kudos👍👌💯

  20. I used to have a problem with depression but realized that if I am unhappy the only person that can fix that is me because nobody can or will do it for me.

  21. Antidepressants have different effects on different people. There are also a lot of different kinds. Personally, Zoloft basically saved my life and allowed me a level of success and personal fulfullment I never thought would be possible for me. Other people I know did not experience the same level of positive change with the antidepressants they were taking.

  22. "The economic anarchy of capitalism is the root of all evil." – Albert Einstein

  23. I get something much worse called sleep paralysis from anxiety which for me leads to lack of quality sleep. I've had it for years and when I experience it during my sleep (which feels like my brain is about to explode), I've been able to actually teach myself to wake up from it. Never heard of anyone that has been through that feeling and that have been able to make themselves wake up.

  24. As a child born in the late 1950s I’m seriously messed up tbh. I don’t know why. I have no medical insurance . I’m worried because I don’t give a shit. I don’t care about anything. Can anyone explain this? Can anyone tell me why I’m thisway? I’m now a sorry sad excuse as a human being.

  25. I found taking a relatively small amount of a SSRI it took the edge off my anxiety and let me approach CBT with a therapist a bit more genuinely (like actually absorb the information and over time start to actively engage & implement strategies working with my therapist) and while its a slow process, im starting to realise that its gradually working & I can think better/approach most situations better. Managing mental health is very much a combined process of various things and it takes time, sometimes a long time but there is definitely a light at the end of that tunnel, despite those moments where it feels like the world is falling on you. Keep your head up folks! @david thanks for these kinds of interviews, I personally find it great info and a good prompt to try to approach my own anxiety challenges from a different perspective.

  26. I’m going to actually read his book which I bought a year ago. This helped so much. Also, it’s very much what Marianne Williamson says.

  27. You know it makes sense because I understand that there was a happiness index by WHO probably that placed the happiest people in some of the poorest countries in Africa even if they were war torn like Somalia.

  28. Who knew people would be miserable when your livelihood is reliant on employers who could lay you off for almost any reason, landlords have more rights than you do concerning where you live, and most people live paycheck to paycheck while racking up unpayable debts…but oh we live in a "democracy." Take this pill and stop questioning things, it's making you depressed!

  29. Wow! I'm a Nurse and have always felt this way about depression. I have several family members with depression and I've tried to convince them to find what changes they could make in their life to help themselves, other than just medicine. This guy makes so much sense. I love the democratic work environment idea!

  30. If depression is not a chemical imbalance, why does he say SSRI's work for some people, is it the placebo affect? Why do they work for some people?

  31. Here's the thing, there isn't a "One size fits all" solution to depression, but it surely isn't something that you can just snap out of by thinking positive, like so many non-depressed people say. I myself think genetics plays a huge part. Why are some people born mentally retarded, or mentally challenged as they say now, was it because they were stressed in the womb? You can't just give someone a pill and make their brain normal again. I think the neurotransmitters in the brain are different for some people, and that's why some people see the glass as half full while others see it as half empty. I do agree with a lot of what Hari said here, but life experience is just a part of the problem.

  32. We can't ignore either depression that arises "on its own", such as a depressive time in bipolar folk. We need to be able to give social help and/or medical help when appropriate. I've also only been to one mental health worker in the USA who didn't agree with the thrust that external factors are often the biggest contributors—they believed they were the /only/ contributors. (Note: anecdotal, small sample size).

  33. Very interesting discussion on depression and anxiety. I learned a lot. Makes perfect sense that when people have control over their lives and their work they would be less depressed and have a greater sense of purpose.

  34. Really appreciate this episode, David! Very thoughtful, and a healthy message the US, and rest of the world needs to hear. But T.A.D. (Trump Anxiety Disorder) wasn't mentioned. 😉

    Now, if only you could replace Jimmy Fallon. 😁

  35. Today's mainstream psychiatry, as virtually everything under capitalism, is a fundamentally corrupted institution. Just like the mainstream medical system, it evolved to first and foremost bring profits to pharmaceutical companies (and trained to not see capitalism as the cause of most psychiatric disorders).
    Here are some very accurate quotes on this topic:

    *"Addiction, self-sabotage, procrastination, laziness, rage, chronic fatigue, and depression are all ways that we withhold our full participation in the program of life we are offered.
    When the conscious mind cannot find a reason to say no, the unconscious says no in its own way."*
    Charles Eisenstein

    "The real hopeless victims of mental illness are to be found among those who appear to be most normal. Many of them are normal because they are so well adjusted to our mode of existence, because their human voice has been silenced so early in their lives, that they do not even struggle or suffer or develop symptoms as the neurotic does. They are normal not in what may be called the absolute sense of the word; they are normal only in relation to a profoundly abnormal society. Their perfect adjustment to that abnormal society is a measure of their mental sickness. These millions of abnormally normal people, living without fuss in a society to which, if they were fully human beings, they ought not to be adjusted."
    Aldous Huxley, Brave New World Revisited

    "It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."
    Jiddu Krishnamurti

  36. Thank God, since I started taking Paxil, I felt great! I started taking it when I was 18. Now, I’m in my 40’s.

  37. So, a lot of what this guy talks about is true in some light, but he's repeatedly conflating different disorders, which is going to cause people to support and spread misinformation about "major depression". His whole "while there are biological factors that can […] make it more difficult to get out" (paraphrasing) GREATLY underplays the seriousness of these epigenetic factors often seem to be caused by environmental factors early in life but are seemingly permanent biological changes after that point. Changing our environment may expose fewer people to these epigenetic changes, but the way he talks about it comes across very similarly to the incredibly disgusting and harmful "just go to the gym" type non-sense that people so often spew.

  38. Worker ownership, now where have I heard that before?
    Really like this way of putting across these ideas as it avoids a few words which tend to cause a very knee-jerk reaction in a lot of people bought up on propaganda.

  39. Lots of good points here. Depression has a multitude of roots and causes and can't be solved with medication.
    Humans are social animals that depend on family and community bonds. People have always been under some amount of pressure and stress but in the modern age, the traditional family and community support is not there to help people cope with it. People are more socially isolated than ever and that has made it worse.
    We have to view depression as a perfectly normal response to an insane environment that most people find themselves in and treat it in ways that are suggested and use drugs only as a last resort.

  40. All the evidence he presents here is anecdotal… BS he must be pushing some funding book or product…Fuck you, who the fuck is this fucking quack?

  41. My long-standing depression lifted after I retired from my job. I never missed the place for one single minute, but I didn't realize how deeply toxic the place was where I worked, with the backbiting, politicizing and jockeying for the VERY few ways to get promoted in that corporation. Sometimes I reflect on all the garbage I no longer have to deal with and am amazed I lasted there as long as I did.

  42. Depressed people are like the orcas in the tank at Sea World with the flopped over dorsal fin, which happens to all captive orcas. Humans evolved to live a much different lifestyle than what we live now. We force ourselves into this society like we force the orcas into the tanks. We are captive.

  43. Wait… hold up… Citations needed Has there been an increase (trend) in rates of depression and anxiety over the years? I don't think we've had stable measurement devices for all that long even… and I've never seen this claim backed up in the literature. I have however heard people conflate societal harms with depression and anxiety for as long as I've been alive… and not once seen evidence to support this. I've been trying to give this guy a fair shake but 12:00 minutes in and all of my red flags are flying high and flapping like they're in a freakin category 5 hurricane.

    edit: And while you're here – something Dave has said before that is as far as I know complete hogwash is this idea that social media has some relation to depression or anxiety – at least in the direction of social media -> depression or anxiety… I mean just a simple consideration of the methodological issues involved in this is… baffling. If there was any evidence of this it would certainly show up epidemiologically – and would be involved as a small part of substantiating the above claim about rates increasing over time…

    You cannot just ask arbitrary questions 'of science' – you begin with evidence then test to determine, not the other way around. If there was any evidence of some impact of social media it would have begun with epidemiological evidence and then been tested to determine if there's an actual relation… I'm not aware of ANY of this existing…

  44. Listening to talking points which point out root causes
    becomes an addiction. I'm a victim of this myself but it was
    a healthy way to resolve my own depression. This started at the age
    of 27 and while 9 years later, it has kept me sane and functioning to the
    best of my understanding of sane & functional.

    Jacque Fresco – Depression, Self Image – Sept. 5, 2011 (1/2)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-0ETX4z_DU

  45. Lack of control at work. Yes, that's one of the big ones. And it brings to the surface something I've been puzzled about for quite a while. Your guest talks about worker co-ops. Similarly, Richard Wolff points to worker co-ops as a way to implement socialism, pointing to the Mondregon co-ops in Spain as an example of how to make the idea work. Well, if you see that as the way to a socialist society, or some other more beneficial system than what we have now. WHAT'S STOPPING US? AFAIK co-ops are legal, and always have been. What really are the barriers to solving these problems from the ground up, on the co-op model?

  46. Iwas taking a certain anti depresant that after a few years I started getting spine spasm….so I had to limit it but than something happened another side effect it thins the blood…I'm not taking it anymore they had to change it

  47. This is profound. But some people in the comments here have completely missed what he’s saying… maybe watch the video again?

  48. You know what's the name of that guy who wanted to bring democracy in the workplace? Conservative outrage incoming.

  49. I see that you are trying to draw on correlations, the problem is you don't take in account diet. Many of the correlations that you are drawing on are from groups that tend to eat less "junk" food. Until you sort that you can't show that your correlations aren't spurious.

  50. This oversimplification of Mental Illness that I am listening to here can be problematic.
    There is a very big difference between analysing Social Stressors and an individual's Neurophysiology.
    I fully understand the limits of the Medical Model, and yes, in this Model Depression/Anxiety etc are diagnostic categories based on observable symptoms.
    However when I found out that my Major Depressive Disorder symptoms had a Physiological Basis it was a huge relief.
    It helped me to understand what I was feeling and the difficulties I was experiencing were real.
    It then allowed me to work out that I was a Person with intrinsic worth and I was not to blame. It helped me accept that the real cause was the Trauma I had experienced, and that it not only had a Psychological impact on me but a significant Neurological impact as well.
    This is Stanford Neuroendocrinologist, Professor Robert Sapolsky giving a lecture on Depression. It's long but this is a complex issue.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOAgplgTxfc

  51. "You worry too much, just stop worrying so much", who has heard this? (Most infuriating thing people tell me)

  52. If you are going to talk about such a serious subject, David, you need to interview experts. I stopped watching about the time when he says "they boght him a cow." Sure. that worked for the farmer. But such an anecdote doesn't negate the necessity of medication, which he is trying to argue. Whether medication is being overused and/or misused, is a different story.

  53. Its unfortunate how we look at Depression, but a true reality of American society is that illness is just very profitable for business. The bitter reality of America is that you're a serf, unless youre extremely wealthy. We dont have the ability to simply change our jobs and lives in an extremely competitive job market. Further, we dont have the social safety nets that permit people to explore treatment options. So in America, even if "becoming a dairy farmer," would solve depression, that cow would cost millions. Our economy is about the olicarchs profiting off the serfs back.

    Plus, if you think being a dairy farmer in this country could reduce your stress, talk to a real dairy farmer…

  54. This is so powerful! Stop calling me crazy, lunatic,a retard , etc. I was traumatized in my childhood into my teens and early 20's. I won't say more. I got an anti-depressant to take. Sleep. Nite.

  55. I honestly don’t believe that these democratic corporate structures work in every industry (like when you need innovation/a unified vision), but I’m sure they work in many and it’s a very worthwhile idea to explore! Apart from that, I think the guy is 100% spot on! There are also studies that show that people have fewer and fewer close friends than in earlier generations. Loneliness is a real epidemic. I think it’s too simplistic to attribute all of these problems to a singular cause (like capitalism) but we really need to address these more seriously and holistically.

  56. I wonder how increased surveillance, loss of privacy and corporate control of every aspect of your life will affect society. :/

  57. Hm….the title of this video is problematic – "The truth"?? So, this bloke has discovered something that a hundred or so years of psychological research has missed?

    Also, at 3:15 he says how even after taking antidepressants he eventually relapsed into depression again, concluding therefore that antidepressants don't work. Did he try another type? I assume that while he was on these meds he didn't continue undergoing regular clinical psych therapy such as CBT, which he should've done. It was negligent of his therapist to simply rely only on the antidepressants to fix him.

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